In today’s episode Alex looks at the impact the real estate crisis may have on the 2022 Korean presidential campaign followed by an in depth conversation with John Walker AM, and Australian businessman who has forged a stunningly successful career in Korea, and continues to search for new ways to contribute to both the business community as well as the wider community.
Alex and Choi Kyungmi discuss the impact of real estate crisis on next year's Korean presidential election, then we deep dive with John Walker, AM and his outstanding career in Korea.
Alex Jensen: It’s Thursday, September 16. I’m Alex Jensen. And you’re listening to Koreabizcast with a KBLA, a certain presidential election creeping up on us. And you know that because the mudslinging and scandals are taking off among the very real issues that could influence the outcome, the real estate market would appear to be right up there. Today, we’ll aim to find out why and what’s at stake. Plus, the story of an expert who has an incredible tale, and who after achieving at all is still hungry for success right here in Korea. Let’s try and find out his secret. And by the way, if you want to give us some feedback, or get involved in our Koreabizcast community, or just share a great idea, send us an email via info@kbla.net. For now, let’s get your headline stories.
Alex Jensen: President Moon Jae-in has celebrated South Korea’s successful test of its first homegrown submarine launched ballistic missile within hours of North Korea illegally firing to ballistic missiles. Unlike Pyongyang’s rogue nuclear program, Seoul comes under the US nuclear umbrella but its own SLBM shows it has a sufficient deterrent to cope with the North according to Moon. Typhoon CHANTHU said to drop up to 300 millimeters of rain on JEJU Island over the next couple of days, as well as drenching Southern mainland provinces. The storm set to pass closest to JEJU tomorrow, with people in affected regions being warned of potential flooding, landslides and other damage. And Samsung’s share of the premium smartphone market dropped to 17% in q2 from 22% in the same quarter last year, while Apple became even more dominant with 57% of the market. Counterpoint research expects Samsung to bounce back in the second half of the year. With the launch of new fold and flip models at a lower price point. Getting a number round up for you the latest daily COVID-19 infections look said to remain close to the 2,000 mark again this morning. Though they were slightly down as of 9pm last night, compared with the same time the day before. As the vaccines. 34.58 million people have had first jobs, which is 67.3% of the population as officials believe we’ll reach 70% this week before the Chuseok holiday. 20.71 million people have been fully vaccinated, which is 40.3% of the population. And the goal is to get that to 70% as well by the end of next month. And the cause be closed up for a fourth session running Wednesday, adding 0.15% to finish and 3,153.4 points. Meanwhile, the Korean Won was up point three against the US dollar to close at 1,170.5.
Alex Jensen: Right then let’s get straight to the presidential election, the real estate market and how the latter could influence the former. Our special issues reporter Kyungmi, Choi is with us to take us through this and I think we’ll start with the main candidates themselves. Thank you very much for joining.
Choi Kyungmi: Thank you for having me.
Alex Jensen: Who are the contenders then? I’m sure a few people have come across their names even on this podcast with some of the scandals that are flying around some of the primary victories we’ve already seen. But it still remains to be seen who will be going up against Who?
Choi Kyungmi: Right so the ruling Democratic Party initially had six contenders for the primary. But it’s now down to five after former Prime Minister Chung Sye-kyun decided to drop out and the leading candidates are of Gyeonggi governor Lee Jae-myung, and former party chairman and also former prime minister Lee Nak-yon. And based on the primary votes conducted so far. Gyeonggi governor is in the lead with around 51% of accumulated votes compared to around 30% of Lee Nak-yon, and the Gyeonggi governor’s main campaign pledge is offering universal basic income for all citizens, which he has been championing even before he joined the presidential race. And as for the main opposition People Power party, it just taught the first round of voting for the primary, and it now has eight candidates left in the race. Our main contenders are former prosecutor general Yoon Seok-youl, and lawmaker Hong Joon-pyo, and Yoon Seok-youl has been leading most polls since March. But analysts predict his ratings to drop as he’s facing allegations of having made an order that led to the main opposition party filing a complaint against pro government figures ahead of last April’s general election. And the two haven’t really laid out detailed campaign pledges yet. But for now, Yoon has vowed to create high quality jobs saying that the number of short-term workers has increased under the current administration. And Hong has pledged to relax various regulations and crease labor flexibility?
Alex Jensen: Well, we shouldn’t really be amazed. But it still is kind of amazing that every election, the same types of issues come around again and again. And real estate is actually one of the issues that comes up in various guises, especially when new ministers go through confirmation hearings because their own real estate record and alleged wrongdoings are often brought to light. But real estate as a market is something that’s a big issue for this election. It we certainly saw earlier this year, didn’t we with the mayoral elections, how influential it was, how important Would you say that is among the range of possible factors that could influence voters?
Choi Kyungmi: If so, in an effort to stabilize the housing market, the Moon’s administration has announced more than 20 rounds of real estate measures of showing the significance of the real estate market issue for Koreans. And this included strengthening taxation for multiple homeowners and ones restricting transactions. And one of the major steps taken was raising the maximum rate of the comprehensive real estate tax to 6% from the previous 3.2%. And these taxes are calculated based on the appraised value of real estate decided by the government. And this year, the appraised value of properties in the capital city rose by nearly 20% on year. But they haven’t been as effective these measures as the government had hoped, or in fact, they have backfired, so housing prices soared as a result of the government’s policy to clamp down on real estate speculation. And particularly in Seoul, apartment prices have gone up over 50% during President Moon Jae-in tenure, and this is according to the government wrong Korea real estate board. And this led to disappointment for the progressive Moon Jae-in supporters. And it’s also triggered a harsh criticism from the conservatives or which was reflected in April’s all by elections for Seoul and Busan that ended in a landslide win for the main opposition People Power party. And what’s notable is also the fact that the defeat for the ruling party came just one year after a major victory in the 2020 April general election where the party secured 180 seats in the 300 member parliament. Well, it also didn’t help that or real estate scandal involving the state-run Korea land and housing or LH as well as the land ministry erupted in early March. And officials were accused of using insider information to buy land in parts of Gyeonggi province that have been designated as public housing development sites in February. And this has seemed to further decrease support for the ruling party and the government, which were already facing public disappointment over a failed economic policies, especially all related to the real estate market. And this was even admitted by President Moon Jae-in himself. But ruling party contenders in this upcoming election have been making pledges to boost housing supply. So, for example, Gyeonggi governor Lee Jae-myung has vowed to supply more than 2.5 million housing units. While former party leader Lee Nak-yon said he would build a new smart city on the outskirts of Seoul. So, this will certainly be one of the most important issues in the upcoming race.
Alex Jensen: Yeah, one thing’s for sure president Moon Jae-in will not be given another term to try to fix this problem because in case anyone’s not aware, in South Korea, we are still at the single term for all presidents. Let’s talk a little bit more about what some of the opposition candidates are promising though to try and fix the big issue.
Choi Kyungmi: Right, so the main opposition contenders are slamming the Moon Jae-in administration saying it’s responsible for the failed real estate policies, or many of them are arguing that it’s necessary to lower real estate holding tax and transfer income tax. And they’re also unveiling plans to expand supply similar to ruling party candidates. And this includes providing housing supply in the private sector through urban redevelopment and reconstruction, as well as public housing for the low-income group and young adults. So, for example, former prosecutor general union Yoon Seok-youl has vowed to provide 2.5 million housing units nationwide. This includes 1.3 million in the capital region, and financial support for newlyweds and young adults in particular, and Representative Hong Joon-pyo said he would supply apartments that are only 1/4 the price level in the current market in downtown areas and Seoul, Gangbuk region are using state owned land and parceling out just the buildings to the private sector. But they have also raised some eyebrows for presenting unrealistic pledges, some even calling the populist policies.
Alex Jensen: Again, a recurring theme whenever we get into an election season. Let’s get a bit more background though on the real estate crisis. And just how bad it is. You said before the prices have been soaring. And if it’s gonna be a big factor in voters’ minds, let’s understand better why.
Choi Kyungmi: So according to all the data from KB, KooKmin Bank Jeonse prices dropped slightly in 2018 in 2019. With that it rose again by 10% last year, and the loan some Jeonse deposit in August this year was at a similar level to apartment purchase prices three and a half years ago. And the average Jeonse price for apartments in Seoul and the surrounding areas stood at around 441,000,000 Won, which is higher than the average sales price in January 2018 a 440,000,000 Won. And the average Jeonse price for apartments in Seoul was 643,000,000 Won, which is similar to nearly four years ago in October 2017. In Gyeonggi province, the average tons of price of 361,000,000 Won was similar to the sales price in November of 2019. And the ratio of transit price compared to sales price in the capital region has been decreasing. But this is because even though Jeonse prices have been on the rise, sales prices jumped by a greater margin. And there’s also been a trend of landlords shifting to monthly rent instead of Jeonse. Which seems to be a result of them trying to make up for the high real estate taxes, especially here in Seoul. Oh, the real estate Information System run by the Seoul Metropolitan Government showed that out of around 12,500 apartment lease contracts made in August 40% were monthly rentals are by four percentage points compared to July. And this is also known to be a result of the government strengthened measures aimed at stabilizing housing prices. But with more landlords switching from Jeonse to monthly rent, it could result in a shortage Jeonse apartments, which could push up Jeonse prices and forced tenants who can’t afford high prices to choose an apartment with monthly rent.
Alex Jensen: I’ll tell you what I’m part of the monthly rent trend and I have been for years here I found the Jeonse system to be very inaccessible by and large, not exclusively, but by and large. Because when you come to Korea without a huge deposit sitting in your bank account to get on the Jeonse ladder, let alone the main property ladder. It’s a challenge and then the monthly rent. You’re at the mercy of rising costs. Landlords pointing the finger at the government, the government looking around, perhaps for someone else to blame. Maybe it’s something we have to ask how do we actually get to this crisis? Do we have a clear answer?
Choi Kyungmi: Right. So, some say that the government’s toughened measures are to blame. Always landlords are, who are facing heavier taxes will want to collect more money from tenants. But then other say that the rampant real estate speculation that’s been ongoing for years here in Korea is the fundamental problem, especially due to the constant cities on the project across the nation. So, I guess we don’t really have a clear answer on this question.
Alex Jensen: Yeah, well, you never really get a much more acute sense of the haves versus the have nots in daily life than when you’re trying to find a home and you don’t own one. And you’re dealing with landlords and you’re at their mercy to a certain extent. But what is the government’s still doing to put it right?
Choi Kyungmi: So, it’s not that the government hasn’t been making any efforts to improve the situation and it has referred to real estate speculation as another form of deep root of evil that’s been prevalent in the society for a long time. And back in March, when there was around one year left until the presidential election, President Moon Jae-in actually said that his administration will focus on restoring order in the real estate market during the remainder of his term, and that this is the most important issue related to people’s livelihood. And this also came around the time when the government and the ruling party faced heavy criticism over the LH scandal. And also following the ruling party’s major defeat in the April by election, President Moon agreed to change some of his real estate policies, as it was the main reason for the loss, and he acknowledged the need to revise some property related policy measures like mortgage regulations and tax hikes to ease the burden for people without houses or single homeowners. But he remained firm on the need to provide more housing and curb real estate speculation. And most recently, this week, Finance Minister Hong Nam-ki said the government will come up with ways to stabilize the transit and monthly rent prices by the end of the year. And this will include expanding housing in downtown areas for single or two person households, as well as short term rentals. And the government also plans to accelerate the speed of supplying apartments by alleviating unnecessary regulations, and providing financial support and tax benefits to businesses.
Alex Jensen: Now, I think we’ve got to talk a little bit about younger people who seem to be really affected. Yes, there might be some foreigners who move here who struggle but the ones who are most sorely affected and who will definitely have a chance to vote in this upcoming election are that young group and they seem to be turning conservative. At least news reports claim more young people are turning conservative because of things like the real estate crisis. Can you elaborate on that for us?
Choi Kyungmi: Right. So, this is not necessarily because young people are no more supportive of the conservative blocks policies. But it seems like this is due mainly to the disappointment in the current administration and the ruling party. With the government struggling to stabilize rising housing prices, this has led to young Korean voters remaining skeptical about being able to own a home or their own home, especially those in Seoul. In addition to facing challenges and paying their rent with limited savings, and political pundits say that young voters could be the deciding factor in the upcoming election. And the government seems to be aware of this. So, in the budget proposal for 2022, which will be the last one drafted by the Moon Jae-in administration, the government allocated 3 trillion Won for initiatives related to young people such as job creation and housing subsidies, and since some experts have pointed out that this is an effort to attract votes from the younger population. Meanwhile, the latest budget proposal was the first in Korea’s history to exceed 600 trillion Won with the national debt expected to surpass 1,000 trillion Won for the first time. And critics say that the government’s expansionary fiscal policy and increase in debt would lead to more taxes. But the government explained that sticking to an expansionary budget would achieve economic recovery and be able to respond to the widening social gap.
Alex Jensen: The more general issue that might be on the very near horizon is the threat of an asset bubble. And that’s another one that a lot of international media have started to pay close attention to. Can we just finish on that note?
Choi Kyungmi: So, Bank of Korea Governor Lee Ju-yeol stated in July that Korea’s housing prices have become overrated. While the finance minister has also warned that a price correction that’s sharper than expected could happen. And some experts are warning about Korea’s real estate market has entered a bubble. It’s especially alarming when looking at Korea’s household debt. And According to the Korea Institute of Finance, this country’s household debt to GDP ratio stood at 90.3% at the end of the first quarter of this year, or by 7 percentage points from the end of 2019. And hustle credit grew by 10.3% or record 168 trillion Won on year in the second quarter to 1,805 trillion Won. And those who are very open asset bubble say that Korea will be dealing with serious consequences, mainly due to the heated housing market if property prices continue to rise until next year. And unfortunately, the trend that we’re we’ve been seeing lately is that apartment prices are continuing to soar. And people are taking out more loans to purchase homes on low-rate mortgages before prices rise even further. But others say that it’s too early to evaluate the current situation as a bubble.
Alex Jensen: So, you got younger people, dreaming of assets and those with assets potentially at risk. Kyungmi, Choi, thank you very much for sharing with us what is obviously a very serious issue going into this election or series of issues. And ones which will have to keep a very close eye on and perhaps revisit with you in the near future.
Choi Kyungmi: Well, thank you for having me.
Alex Jensen: You’re listening to Koreabizcast with KBLA and if you want to get involved as a sponsor, or have a business opportunity, you want to share email us info@kbla.net. Let’s head straight into Part Two next, and an expert story. You won’t forget in a hurry.
Alex Jensen: So, you might be pleased to hear that the outlook is far from pessimistic overall, in fact, now might be a great time to be doing business in Korea. Let’s connect with Australian business leader John Walker, who’s left about as much of a positive imprint on Korea as any expert could hope to. Thanks also for being with us today.
John Walker: It’s a pleasure, Alex, it’s good to talk to you again.
Alex Jensen: Yeah. And officially it’s John Walker AM. It’s the Member of the Order of Australia. Can you just tell us a little bit about how you earned that and what it means to you?
John Walker: Oh, yeah, sure. Well, it’s slightly embarrassing, but generally people that worked in government, which I did at the time would have got this at the end of the day Korea. But I was I was fortunate in that I had got the role of designing the transportation plan for Sydney’s Olympic bid. So, one of the reasons that I was awarded the Order of Australia was that we were obviously successful in our bid to gain the Olympics and obviously, the transportation plans a very important part of that bid. I was also fortunate in that I was the head of the Australian Capital, territory government and we implemented a lot of changes in the area of economic reform. So, the other thing in the citation was in recognition of achievement of some government economic reforms. So these are generally awarded to people that have contributed significantly to society. Movie Stars, sports people, doctors, researchers, scientists, humanitarians, philanthropists, etc. So, I feel very privileged and lucky to have been to have been recognized for the service that I had given as part of a government,
Alex Jensen: We can’t possibly cover the entirety of your career, which has just so many of these talking points. But from a career perspective over 20 years ago, you set up Macquarie, Korean business with only three staff. It was obviously a different world then, and certainly a very different career. Can you take us back in time to your mission then? And how you approached it?
John Walker: Sure. Well, basically, my mission was not so clearly defined the way in which Macquarie worked, and still does, to some extent was, if people had an interest in building a business in a particular market, they would put their hand up and say, ‘Hey, I would like to go there’. And your boss would say, ‘Okay, he’s an air ticket. One Way Ticket’ awkward. And, and off you go, and let’s get to know the market and see what we can do. The reason that I put my hand up and volunteered for Korea is that I had been reading about how the government was growing so strongly out of the then crisis, economic crisis. And we’re looking at things like bringing private sector capital into essential infrastructure. And I’d also heard from some work that we’ve been doing that Korean financial institutions, we’re looking to broaden and develop what they did. So, I thought this seemed to be a fertile market for an Australian financial institution that had some quite unique products that had been grown in the Australian market. So I jumped on a plane and I came.
Alex Jensen: And that expansion since then, kind of speaks for itself, because so many people listening now will be familiar with Macquarie here in Korea and the legacy that you’ve left behind. But are there any particularly memorable highlights along the two decades plus since then, that you’d like to share with us?
John Walker: Yeah, well, look, we only philosophy was only to seek to do business where we were number one in our home market, or where we had a particular edge. So, things like infrastructure investment, trading in commodities, which are a byproduct of Australia’s own economy and drive Australia’s own economy. So, we’re very open to partnerships with Korean financial institutions, where we can bring some products and strengths that they did not have. So, if you’d like we adopted this principle of generosity, sharing profit, entering into joint ventures sharing knowledge, and supporting the domestic capital markets. And the things that, you know, are quite memorable that came out of that were the first infrastructure fund, which we closed in the year 2000. With a whole bunch of domestic Korean pension funds and others, and then later the listing of that fund in 2006, on both the Korean Stock Exchange, and the London Stock Exchange, which basically grew a $300 million fund into a top 50 Korean company, a $2.5 billion company. That fund is still trading on the Korean Stock Exchange and is making a lot of money for people who are retiring because it’s the returns are linked to the cost of living. The other thing that was quite memorable as a supplier in the IMG bearings securities business in Korea in 2006. stepping in and rescuing the grand Incheon bridge project, when the key investor withdrew from that project and lifted high and dry is one of the things that stands out in my mind being the first foreign financial institution to get an equity link warrants trading license. And of course, more recently partnering with groups such as SK in acquiring companies like ADT Caps, and morphing away from being a general infrastructure investor, to specializing in developing large scale renewable energy projects, such as offshore wind. I guess the thing that really stands out for me is that at one point, I think by around 2010, the infrastructure projects that we’re investing in which were projects that were still being built, created, we estimated at the time around 44,000 construction jobs in Korea. And there’s something that I remember that I remember very fondly.
Alex Jensen: Well, as we look back at your history, how engaged you are how active you are in various fields covering the sports like you mentioned before the Sydney Olympics, Taekwondo for example, which is actually a bridge for you, between Australia and Korea in many ways. Is it key to you for success that you do stay active in various fields? Or is it something that you’ve done simply because you’ve enjoyed doing so? Or perhaps even a little bit of both?
John Walker: Yeah, I think it’s a bit of both Alex, it’s, I think it’s really important to be who you are. And I think it’s really important to live a full life, you know, you never know what you might come back is right. So, music, writing, Taekwondo and I guess this broad category of gaming has actually always been an important part of my life. And there seems to be no logic and just continuing those things. And allowing your, if you’re like your professional life, to dominate, I think the important thing about being who you are and continuing to pursue your passions is it allows you to achieve balance, I think it really helps your judgment. So, when you’re making a business decision, you think a little more about people who may be affected, you look at it from a different dimension. And similarly, when you make a decision about something which is not commercial, for example, something that’s charitable, you can look at it more with a business perspective. So you’re not just throwing money away. So, I think these, these complements to my professional life, are actually beneficial to both my personal and my professional life, if you like.
Alex Jensen: What continues to drive you now at this point, when from the outside, many people would say, wow, you’ve achieved so much you can sit back and drink cocktails or tea or whatever you want, and just create music for yourself, as I know you like to do. I mean, do you think you’ll ever fully retire from all those other engagements?
John Walker: Yeah. retirements not really a word that competes with me, to be honest. You know, I think I’m a fairly driven individual. And when I think about well, why is that the case? I think I’m driven by wanting to touch and feel a difference that I’ve made somewhere. So in a business sense, something like, you know, building a solar farm, or building a wind farm, or building a bridge, or watching a business grow, is extremely satisfying. You can touch and feel what you done. It’s not esoteric, so that, you know, really the ability to sort of actually be part of something that’s been grown and built and delivered is for me, really essential in my life. And particularly, also in thinking about what difference have you made to someone’s life? So, for me, the you know, the ultimate satisfaction is seeing a difference made in people’s lives. And a difference in something if you like, physical, physical, that’s disappearing, you know, with a bridge or a power station, or, or a business. So, I think, yeah, I think I’m just driven by those things. And there’s not a day goes by when I’m not thinking about, well, wouldn’t it be great? If we can do this, we’ll see that this is why I’m so strict. Alex, I think, last count, I had 14 business cards, but so long, I think someone was you can achieve that balance that I’m talking about earlier. And so long as you can bring the energy that you need to bring something when you commit to it. I think that’s a great way of just continuing your life.
Alex Jensen: I mentioned as well before how much things have changed in the world. In the last year and a bit, it’s pretty obvious to us what a catalyst that has been. And I know that you’ve been coining this phrase, the democratization of transport and power. We should ask you to elaborate on that. Because there are people who may be listening from various fields, various industries, but for all of us in some way that that’s going to be relevant.
John Walker: Yeah, sure. Well, I think what I think what the COVID world has done, is it’s led to an acceleration of a trend that was already developing with consumers and people generally have had a change, changing mindsets and changing expectations about how they want to receive services that have traditionally been dominated by one or two sectors. And I think this acceleration is really generated opportunities for a true gig economy. So, when we’re not talking about democratization of energy, for example, people now globally have more choices as to how they consume their energy, how they buy their energy, whether or not they’re buying renewable energy or a mix of renewable and non-renewable whether on paper providing their own energy and can’t come from countries like Australia and the US, where increasingly people are going off grid and installing batteries and having solar or there are technologies that allow you to pick and choose which electricity provider, for example, you might want and you can make judgments about whether or not that electricity they’re producing is clean and whether it’s green. And this goes across into transportation and we’re seeing that in spades in Korea, where you can wake up in the morning and decide that you’re going to get the subway, or you’re going to get a KAKAO cab, or you’re going to get a regular cab, or are you going to live right next door to the office you work in? or are you not going to go to an office at all? and are you going to move into a new apartment where that department store used to be. There’s no longer there because you now buy everything online. So, these are the sorts of things democratization, meaning consumers are now having a choice of ways in which they received their services, and received the goods. And this, this is great for people that don’t want to stick to the traditional model of business. Not it’s not only ordinary consumers, but it’s large corporations and financial institutions that are now deciding that they might want to receive their services in different ways. Perhaps they don’t want to hire, perhaps a large corporate doesn’t want to hire an investment bank, which will cost them millions and millions of dollars to do a mergers and acquisitions exercise. Perhaps it might hire an individual who can bring that same service at a better price. So, this mindset change, I think it’s going to be quite pervasive across the world and particularly in Korea.
Alex Jensen: So, speaking about this changing environment, do you continue to feel optimistic about Korea as a place to do business?
John Walker: Yes, yes, I do. I’m, I’m unashamedly optimistic. You know, one of the great things that I’ve always felt about Korea once I got to know it, and it took a little while is that one of its greatest strengths is that it’s not rich in a lot of natural resources, oil and gas, even wind and some of the new resources, Uranium. But it’s so rich in the area of its human resources, its people. And I think that’s the secret and that’s the secret as to why even over these few months Korea has generally continued to prosper across the economy although obviously there is some pain being felt amongst smaller companies such as restaurants and things, that I think that if you look at how Korea has positioned now, it has much more sophisticated financial institutions and it had 20 years ago, they are now much more global, it is generally much more outward looking. So, a lot of the profit that comes for Korea corporations now is not just dependent on the domestic economy as we know, the Samsung and Hyundai. The others of this world are reaping significant profits across a whole range of diversified markets. So the exposure of the economy is much more diversified than it was 20 years ago. And there’s still a thirst for knowledge. And there’s still a thirst for experience. And I think that Korea continues to welcome overseas expertise into the market as well as being able to bring its own expertise in into other markets. And a good example of that is this whole push towards a cleaner and greener society. People probably don’t realize that there’s at least $100 billion that’s going to be invested in Korea into offshore wind projects. And they probably many people probably don’t realize that that has bought a plethora of European and other major companies and investors in the Korea that are working hand in hand with domestic companies to bring the expertise in the experience just in this one sector of renewable energy. And of course, this is going to create 1,000s of jobs 1,000s of opportunities for new businesses and new enterprises. So, I think if you look below the surface, and if you like move beyond what you might read in the various competing parts of the of the traditional media, there’s a huge amount of activity going on that is changing the nature of the economy in Korea, and providing enormous investment employment and you know, multiplier opportunities for the economy.
Alex Jensen: You set up Macquarie’s Korean business back in 2000. If that had been happening in 2021, if you can imagine your entire life shifting a couple of decades forward, do you feel that things would have played out very differently for you or not?
John Walker: Frankly, I think things could largely have played out the same way. But you know, instead of enlisting, and helping institutions understand how to invest into things like toll roads, or ports, we would be doing this in the area of these new areas of infrastructure that I was talking about hydrogen, wind, offshore wind, in particular, solar, instead of investing into things like subway line 9 we may have been investing into logistics companies, cold storage, logistics companies that are essential for things like vaccines or the logistic companies that are essential for this huge growth in online shopping and delivery services. And we would have been investing in new types of financial products, which probably would have meant much more offshore cooperation between Macquarie and the Korean financial institution than just the domestic cooperation. At one point, we had a joint venture with every major financial banking in Korea with a different financial product for each, that those products were only being sold in the Korean market. I suspect, if we fast forward 20 years, we would have been selling these products together both in the Korean market and offshore markets. So, I think it would have largely played out the shaman the same if we had the same attitude towards partnership, bringing products that the domestic institutions didn’t have experience with. And then making a veil and this principle of generosity that we had at the time making available our offshore businesses to them for joint venturing in offshore markets. So I don’t want to be overly optimistic. But I think it was more the approach that we took, which would still apply today, rather than the sort of specific business opportunities.
Alex Jensen: Well, I know that even with all the travel that you do, and have continued to had to do, perhaps in a slightly more limited basis due to COVID-19. You still are here to be found in Korea, whether Seoul or Busan and I’m sure that many people who’ve listened now would love to have the opportunity to meet you in person and to be further inspired by you. It’s been fantastic to have your time now. I look forward to getting your next business card as well. But for now, John Walker AM, Best luck with all your ongoing projects.
John Walker: Thank you, Alex. Look forward to talking again at some stage in the future. Thank you.
Alex Jensen: Well, thank you very much to John Walker and to our special issues reporter Kyungmi, Choi for being with us before that, and to you for joining us on day 4 of our pilot week. We’ve heard of gray clouds circling ahead of the presidential election, but I think John may just about have shown us enough sunshine to feel optimistic. Now we’re going to have a break for Chuseok and think about what we can do to make Koreabizcast the podcast you don’t want to be without so please share any feedback you might have via info@kbla.net. Otherwise, we still have day 5 to come. So until tomorrow from 7am, Korea time.